Speeduino is now on Github Sponsors (Rather than Patreon): https://github.com/sponsors/noisymime
Help with building your Speeduino, installing it, getting it to run etc.
By HunterS628
#24628
Alright guys, this is my first post here and my first venture into the amazing world of efi, and damn am I excited. Cant wait to ditch my old carb! So here is my plan for the build. I have a 1971 VW Beetle that I recently built an engine for. It is a wayy overbuilt 1641cc engine with forged crank and rods big valve ported heads and a Scat c20 cam, which is big for a carbed engine of this size. Now I am converting to full sequential fuel and spark with help from a stock Mexican beetle EFI manifold setup which I will run with Speeduino. I am going to use a single, distributor mounted trigger system which I have already made from a stock VW distributor and a 1996 honda civic distributor.
Image
I would like to run this all off of a board like what bradacz has made in this thread, or what NickZ has created in this thread viewtopic.php?f=16&t=376 where everything is incorporated into one board. I have no pcb design experience however so i would like to find someone with designs they are willing to share and go from there. Two problems that I am running into are 1.) I didnt notice my lathe had a 10 thou flutter in it when I center drilled the trigger wheel creating this issue with the VR sensor voltages since the teeth are not all equal distance to the sensor due to the off center hole (please note, I am not an electronics guru, I am 18 years old and am learning as I do, so I have no idea what the settings on this scope tell you, but I do know the peak voltages of the trigger wheel should all be the same) :roll:
Image
Image
Zoomed on one cycle with voltage set approx at top and bottom.
2.) I will be running a plenum style manifold and it seems that the two board designs I listed above are not compatible with an Idle Air Control Valve.
This project is intended to be a long-ish term so this thread may go weeks without posts or may be updated daily, Im just not sure yet, but i plan to finish by June. The main goal of me making this thread is to gain knowledge, document my progress, get constructive criticism and advise from the great speeduino community, and hopefully leave a good thread for future builders. I will be posting lots of pictures, questions, and documentation of my progress as the build goes on and I hope you all will come along for the ride!

Thank you in advance,
Hunter Stephens.

EDIT:
Due to incompetence and partly ADD, I seemed to have missed Fram's board design which seems to fit my needs perfectly. Found here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=1099
However, I am trying to upload the manufacturing files found in his github but am not sure how to do it. If anyone can recommend an affordable pcb manufacturer and how I can upload the files, I would greatly appreciate it!
Thanks Again!
By Jama
#24631
Hello.

Looks like your project is off to a good start. Hopefully the trigger issue isn't to hard to overcome but I can't comment on that.

With regards to fully assembled standalone boards, no-one that I am aware of is selling one.
FRAM's board looks great, the only thing is it is 4 layer which means production of it is not that cheap especially in small quantity.

Can I ask why you are not going to use the v0.4 series of speeduino board?
These are readily variable in kit and assembled form.
It is also a proven design and easy for people to remote support you with.
I'd advise getting up and running on one of those then swapping the board out later if you are set on standalone.

James.
By HunterS628
#24638
Jama wrote:
Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:46 am
Hello.

Looks like your project is off to a good start. Hopefully the trigger issue isn't to hard to overcome but I can't comment on that.

With regards to fully assembled standalone boards, no-one that I am aware of is selling one.
FRAM's board looks great, the only thing is it is 4 layer which means production of it is not that cheap especially in small quantity.

Can I ask why you are not going to use the v0.4 series of speeduino board?
These are readily variable in kit and assembled form.
It is also a proven design and easy for people to remote support you with.
I'd advise getting up and running on one of those then swapping the board out later if you are set on standalone.

James.
I have always planned on assembling the board myself, and I am pretty good at that. I like the idea of everything being on one board, it is more compact, and seems like there are fewer connections that can go bad. Trigger wheel will be easy to fix once I get my lathe back in proper adjustment. I am a mechanic and builder at heart with electronics coming in second, and boy do I love a challenge (you should see the house Im building right now, talk about challenging!) :) Therefore, I would much rather assemble my own board and have it be something that I wont have to change out down the road and if that means spending more time troubleshooting, so be it!

Thanks for your input,
Hunter
User avatar
By PSIG
#24639
Good stuff! 8-) Hunter, the signal would preferably of course be even, if only to satisfy OCD. :lol: However, the issue with off-center or wobbly wheels is two-fold, with one being insufficient voltage to trigger a signal at it's low point, and variation of detected speed due to wider spacing of the pulse edges (larger pulses appear to the system to have wider pulse width near 0V crossing point).

For the first issue, it looks like your wheel will work, as it has enough signal voltage at your test RPM (about 400 rpm from the images, right?). So that does not appear to be a problem for your setup, even though it's the first issue wobbly wheels have - not enough signal at cranking speed so they lose sync and can't start. With a low battery, you may have issues though, so keep that in-mind until you eventually correct the wheel run-out.

For the second issue, this problem is not so much an issue for Speeduino; as unlike some other systems does not read both edges of the signal. Only one, either leading or trailing, and in your case you would use trailing in order to clearly detect the missing tooth gap with falling edge. The key issue with other systems would be ignition advance timing variation. If you wish to test in order to verify that it's not a concern, I would spin it up on Speeduino, and watch for spark advance variation at stable shaft speed. If timing is solid or a minimal variance, then you don't need to fix your wheel. ;)

As to the 'standalone' question James posed; perhaps you can tell us what features you are after in your board selection, or the features you don't want, and why? You say "all on one board", but the other boards use modules attached, or have internal coil drivers that can bring their own set of issues. There is no problem with "just because", but be aware there are consequences to any choice.

David
By HunterS628
#24642
PSIG wrote:
Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:16 pm
Good stuff! 8-) Hunter, the signal would preferably of course be even, if only to satisfy OCD. :lol: However, the issue with off-center or wobbly wheels is two-fold, with one being insufficient voltage to trigger a signal at it's low point, and variation of detected speed due to wider spacing of the pulse edges (larger pulses appear to the system to have wider pulse width near 0V crossing point).

For the first issue, it looks like your wheel will work, as it has enough signal voltage at your test RPM (about 400 rpm from the images, right?). So that does not appear to be a problem for your setup, even though it's the first issue wobbly wheels have - not enough signal at cranking speed so they lose sync and can't start. With a low battery, you may have issues though, so keep that in-mind until you eventually correct the wheel run-out.

For the second issue, this problem is not so much an issue for Speeduino; as unlike some other systems does not read both edges of the signal. Only one, either leading or trailing, and in your case you would use trailing in order to clearly detect the missing tooth gap with falling edge. The key issue with other systems would be ignition advance timing variation. If you wish to test in order to verify that it's not a concern, I would spin it up on Speeduino, and watch for spark advance variation at stable shaft speed. If timing is solid or a minimal variance, then you don't need to fix your wheel. ;)

As to the 'standalone' question James posed; perhaps you can tell us what features you are after in your board selection, or the features you don't want, and why? You say "all on one board", but the other boards use modules attached, or have internal coil drivers that can bring their own set of issues. There is no problem with "just because", but be aware there are consequences to any choice.

David
David,
Thanks for the great info! I will definitely test it on Speeduino as soon as i decide on a board and get it put together to see what happens, but in the end I am going to correct the issue with the wobbly wheel just to satisfy the OCD as you said. When I said "all on one board," I meant as many modules as possible incorporated on one board, I.E. the Arduino, and VR conditioner mainly. It would be great to have coil drivers on board, for compactness sake, but if it would be that big of an issue I could settle on having an external module. I do plan on using Chevy "LS2" coils which have igniters built in, not sure if this solves the issue or not. Here is some more info on them about half way down the page: http://www.megamanual.com/seq/coils.htm
I will list the features that would exist on my "ideal board" so to speak, for the sake of aiding in my decision making process and making it easier for recommendations. (Some of these may be pretty obvious)
-Built in Arduino and VR conditioner
-4 injector channels, for full sequential
-4 ignition channels, compatible with LS2 coils
-Inputs for IAT, TPS, Wideband O2, Cylinder Head Temp (since its an aircooled engine), MAP, Maybe oil pressure and temp? again since its aircooled
-Obviously VR input, but also flexible if i change to a Hall sensor
-Output for a IAC valve, I think mine is PWM as it is only 2 pins
-Fan output, based on oil temp
-Small footprint
-Molex or similar style outputs
I know Im probably missing some vital I/O features since Im still new to this but those are the basics I could come up with on the spot. Since Im not doing an ECU swap i feel like I can be a little more flexible with the feature list. I would like to have room for expansion too, I have plans to eventually (after I get EFI up and running) add a really small turbo just for giggles. :D
Let me know what you guys think, youre the experts, Im just a kid with a dream.

Thanks again,
Hunter
User avatar
By PSIG
#24644
HunterS628 wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:54 am
It would be great to have coil drivers on board, for compactness sake, but if it would be that big of an issue I could settle on having an external module. I do plan on using Chevy "LS2" coils which have igniters built in, not sure if this solves the issue or not. Here is some more info on them about half way down the page: http://www.megamanual.com/seq/coils.htm
Yes, we are quite familiar with the LSx coils, as they were the first type recommended for use with Speeduino. ;) While there is much voodoo around when an internal coil driver would cause issues or not, and we cannot afford 150 prototypes or pay experts to do the analysis; we simply suggest external coil drivers either as modules (generally OEM types) or 'smart' coils. Most OEMs have followed the external concept, and we have followed that lead with great success.
HunterS628 wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:54 am
I will list the features that would exist on my "ideal board" so to speak, for the sake of aiding in my decision making process and making it easier for recommendations. (Some of these may be pretty obvious)
. . .
That's a great list and well-rounded response. I would agree those are all great goals, and designing your own boards may be the solution. I would also agree with Jama from the standpoint of running your engine on EFI sometime this year or next, and also with the dramatic increase in functional knowledge and perspective you will gain, that you consider beginning with something easy, well supported, and proven. That is likely one of the standard 'official' boards v0.3.x or v0.4.x as previously mentioned. I say this as I know you will want to construct your dream box just right, and running an existing one first will give you many ideas and new perspectives on how you would do that, compared to today. There are many features you will find have more or less importance after you actually get to use one, and you can always easily sell it when you're done making your new dream box — although you will likely use it on something else or a friend will beg you out of it. :lol: But it's your dream and your call.
HunterS628 wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:54 am
Let me know what you guys think, youre the experts, Im just a kid with a dream.
Being a kid and having a dream is a vital component of a project like this, no matter your age. Based on your responses; welcome to a new part of the automotive world that I'm sure you will enjoy.
Image
David
By HunterS628
#24652
PSIG wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:51 am
HunterS628 wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:54 am
It would be great to have coil drivers on board, for compactness sake, but if it would be that big of an issue I could settle on having an external module. I do plan on using Chevy "LS2" coils which have igniters built in, not sure if this solves the issue or not. Here is some more info on them about half way down the page: http://www.megamanual.com/seq/coils.htm
Yes, we are quite familiar with the LSx coils, as they were the first type recommended for use with Speeduino. ;) While there is much voodoo around when an internal coil driver would cause issues or not, and we cannot afford 150 prototypes or pay experts to do the analysis; we simply suggest external coil drivers either as modules (generally OEM types) or 'smart' coils. Most OEMs have followed the external concept, and we have followed that lead with great success.
HunterS628 wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:54 am
I will list the features that would exist on my "ideal board" so to speak, for the sake of aiding in my decision making process and making it easier for recommendations. (Some of these may be pretty obvious)
. . .
That's a great list and well-rounded response. I would agree those are all great goals, and designing your own boards may be the solution. I would also agree with Jama from the standpoint of running your engine on EFI sometime this year or next, and also with the dramatic increase in functional knowledge and perspective you will gain, that you consider beginning with something easy, well supported, and proven. That is likely one of the standard 'official' boards v0.3.x or v0.4.x as previously mentioned. I say this as I know you will want to construct your dream box just right, and running an existing one first will give you many ideas and new perspectives on how you would do that, compared to today. There are many features you will find have more or less importance after you actually get to use one, and you can always easily sell it when you're done making your new dream box — although you will likely use it on something else or a friend will beg you out of it. :lol: But it's your dream and your call.
HunterS628 wrote:
Thu Mar 01, 2018 1:54 am
Let me know what you guys think, youre the experts, Im just a kid with a dream.
Being a kid and having a dream is a vital component of a project like this, no matter your age. Based on your responses; welcome to a new part of the automotive world that I'm sure you will enjoy.
Image
David
David,
This is the reason I joined this community. For the educated, detailed, and polite posts that can not be found everywhere. I really have been considering going with the v0.4 board, since it have more features I would use, and creating my own pcb for a breakout adapter to teach myself how to design boards. I think since it is more readily available, and like you said I can always sell it down the road, (or who knows maybe build a street car to put it on ;) ) go with the v0.4. I think I will order the board within the next week or so. Is there anything special I should be aware of, or would I be better off going with the v0.3 since it already has screw terminal outputs that I could replace with molex? Also do the boards come with an assembly manual that aides with setup and whatnot? I can figure out component placement, that is no problem for me, I need more help on the software side.

Thanks again,
Hunter
By Jama
#24658
I think that is the smart thing to do for now.

If you do plan to swap the board out at a later date the v0.3.7 (latest version) will be ideal, as the screw terminals will allow you to get it setup without to much faf and then you can disconnect and change things to your hearts content.

The boards don't come with a printed manual, all the latest information is on the wiki.
Here: https://speeduino.com/wiki/index.php/Getting_Started
There you can find some assembly hints and settings for each board variant.
There is also a section dedicated to getting the latest firmware and the base map onto the arduino itself.

Hope that helps
James.
By HunterS628
#24664
PSIG wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:50 am
HunterS628 - what part of the planet are you generally located?

David
I am located in Washington State, USA. I know of a few tuning shops near me, I live in a rural area with not much within an hours drive. Ive talked to one shop about 30 minutes away about what Im doing and they said since it runs tuner studio they will be able to tune it on their dyno if I want. Also a guy named Mario runs a Aircooled VW fuel injection shop about 2.5 hours away called The Dub Shop. He builds kits for these cars so he is a good resource, but he only does MS hardware. http://thedubshop.com/

Thanks again,
Hunter
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 7

i saw a video from the speeduino channel about bu[…]

Reset_Control

Very good to all, I am running a speeduino v0.4.3c[…]

In my case the clamp is behind the fuse so the[…]

Good afternoon, test the vvt map leaving off "[…]

Still can't find what you're looking for?