[AlainNotHere]

Hi,
TLDR; wanted to do a FI project, got a Honda J30 running with speeduino

Little bit longer version:
Here is the J30 on it's stand, the previous version of the project, a 212cc engine meant for lawn mowers and go karts (take the gold.. (Mario voice, totally not the the one from Mario Kart... All Nintendo references will be omitted from the final post)).


Here is the project file for the J30 with the settings used to start right now
https://raw.githubusercontent.com/alain ... ndaJ30.msq

And Here is the Predator one.. (search for some clever joke including chwairejlaieneger and the predator movie)
https://raw.githubusercontent.com/alain ... r212cc.msq

Lesser longer but no so smaller version... long long time ago in a far away land... a geek with a GS500 tough to himself... how difficult could it be to do a FI system, at that time I did the very dumb mistake of trying to do the whole thing as shields over the arduino... which was an interesting project.. but got the bike to run just for brief moments...

Last december I was like... another computer?... (sees from the corner of your eye the pile of thinkpads...) nahhh... and then I remember the itch with the FI, I did some research and bought the parts to build an speeduino, the 0.3 version with the surface mount components.... (they are like very small cars and worms running in the land of cooper traces... you gave them a mortgage on a through hole of the board and now they have to work forever....).

I initially thought of buying the J30 but notice Harbor Freight... (where the best tools are sold.... this message is brought to you by your inner mechanic... what does he use when he need something... Haaaaaaaarrrrrbor freigh... (read with pirate accent)) had the predator 212cc engine on sale for 99$ bucks https://www.harborfreight.com/65-hp-212 ... 69730.html , so I decided to try to get the thing running first on that engine and then if everything is good and the itch is not gone... buy the J30.

Eventually got the Harbor Freight engine running, used a CB500 throttle body and a CB500 fuel tank and fuel pump for the setup.

And then because I'm a very decisive person... right? I spent days thinking about it and then impulsively went to buy a Diet coke... nothing like diet coke for the hot winter right? well.. the dispenser was by pure luck on this place where they sell JDM engines... so

Note to whoever tries to replicate the adventure.. buy a engine crane (like for example the one on sexy red from HF (wink, sexy wink))... if you don't you will basically do some acrobatics, bolt the engine to an engine stand and then with the help of not one, not two, not three... but 2 jacks... not the one from the movie... got it down from the costco table where the j30 was waiting for the moment when the flimsy table broke and fall to the ground...

Now with the engine on the ground bla bla bla will complete the post later

Need to talk about
- Starter setup
- Use only the correct tools... the most amazing tools... the highest quality...
- 3d print pickup wheel and optic sensor for the predator engine
- 3d print 36-1 on crank pulley pickup wheel, modified cam gear with 36-1 wheel to use magnetic sensor, modifying the existing 12 thing already used by honda.... please do not use the dremel to have a 12-1 pickup wheel... that could work
- use only genuine honda parts... like the honda camry flywheel... or the Toyot.... I mean HondOta camry starter.. or the I'm pretty sure Honda CHR radiator... or the honda 4runner fuel injectors because the ones that came with the engine were toasted
- I'm planning to tune the engine to something like 3k horsepower... I mean it has 3 stickers on the top... this is serious (not so serious to have a monster and a VR46 sticker yet... that's like top feed drag level...)

[Kinetic Research]

Well done, good setup. Thanks for sharing/posting, it's really nice to see some J-series love.

Very interested in your setup, looking forward to more pictures/details. A perfect example of a kludge.

What throttle body have you have used?

[AlainNotHere]

What throttle body have you have used?

Heeeey Kinetic Research, thanks for the post, I hope this doesn't remove any potential research from you... (what a bad joke)

It's the stock intake that comes with the J30, this is a JDM so I have no clue what car was in, but I think here in the US it went into the Accord 3.0 V6 1998 to 200X, I've been using that manual for most of the stuff and there are very small differences, there is a prior version of this engine with a distributor which will make amazingly simple to add a 36-1 tooth disk, that came on the 1996 to 1998 I think.
I removed the thing that goes on the bottom of the stock throttle body that I think it's used to set the idle, when it's running idles at 1000ish rpm with the idle tube closed, that part removed and the throttle closed.

A perfect example of a kludge.

Ohh please, no need of so much flattery, I know my welding skills make look some areas like the beard curls of some greek god, or my cable management that can easily go into reddit cableporn area.... or the curls of another greek god... or my hose management that could be missed for the .... you got it...

I mean, hard work pays off in almost OEM looks, the best screws to block hoses.... be it water, fuel, coolant... or the very uniform set of bolts and nuts everywhere... all from the same drawer of lost things and no hack of any kind like the 36-1 pickup wheel with screws tapped to the front bank cam belt gear and then welded to the pickup wheel...

the thing now starts everytime (that I have fuel in the tank... duh me), runs all the way to 180f and then stays there with a fan running against the radiator, kind of have that feeling that the project it's done...

https://youtu.be/htrWK1V8avs






work quality:

4.5 poopys out of 5

[AlainNotHere]

What a pain to loose the post to a back button thing....

Things that have been difficult on the J30 speeduino thing:

Pickup wheel,
In my mind this should be the easiest thing to do but due to lack of documentation/spec sheets for the different VR/Hall sensors it's a complete pain, I bought like 10 different sensors just to discover the different type of smoke they produce when wired incorrectly.

If I could send a message back to past me would be:

"You are Luke's fath... I mean, just use https://wtmtronics.com/product/mini-max ... tioner-vr/ and whatever is on the engine already"

The VR/Hall sensors are very sensitive to the spacing and deep of the teeth and even if wired correctly a random combo, specially if using small pickup wheels is pure pain.

The J30 engine at least in the version I use has a 12 teeth pickup used for speed calculating, so in the spirit of "keep everything as it is, don't mess with... stop, no, common leave the dremel... it's over I'm out....." I remove one of the teeth from the OEM J30 crank pickup wheel timing gear thing whatever...



And after lobotomy



once I wired it to the speeduino -VR and RPM1, set up the jumper for VR and install the flashy and amazing signal conditioner the thing worked no issues the first time.

The combo of VR/signal conditioner is still prone to pickup noise from vibrations, for example when I'm carefully threading a 3/8inch bolt into the SAE 10 thingy using the amazing HF(tm) powerWrenchDestroyer+ the impact driver for some reason come to play will trigger the pickup and report in excess of 10,000 rpm...

why does that, those bolts said: machine bolts... I don't get it!

I tried other approaches that did work but whatever is there on the engine is way more reliable that what my artfully and crafts-fully hands can built... because I'm humble

approach 8B: 3d print a 36-1 pickup wheel and use one of this: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07PM ... UTF8&psc=1 to trigger the signal, that did work, you can get a signal and will work as long as you can supply an adequate bracket... again this is not automotive grade electronics so I'll not recommend using that on a daily driver, more like your experimental bench
you can see the pickup wheel glued to the accessories pulley on the front of the engine on the images above.

approach 5318008: do not read the number upside down on a calculator.... I bought one of this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00B2LCDQA?ps ... ct_details and amazingly and cleverly tried to weld it to the top right camshaft belt pulley but as you know sometimes reality doesn't like welding aluminum to steel it didn't like it.
So I proceed to tap the spaces on the cam for 3 bolts, add the holes in the pickup wheel and then weld the bolt to the pickup wheel for extra security...

because everything has been and will be safe... I mean double check that welding aluminum magnesium things is totally safe... no amazing sparks or unquenchable fire....

OEM cam (I know if I don't add these titles, it's so difficult to tell apart one for the other, that quality!)


Frankenwelnesmeisterfrolicious...


I have not been able to track down what's the sensor used with that pickup wheel, but I bought one of these https://www.ebay.com/itm/180941753083 and they reliably-ish pick up the signal

[PSIG]

So an issue with the J30 decoder, or your sensor setup, to force cutting a tooth? If pursuing a different sensor, you're not considering a Hall/GMR/digital sensor to skip the variable sine wave-to-square wave gymnastics?

I'm the first one to say "You can make almost anything work, eventually", but I'll also say that some paths are more difficult than others. I support using what you have, until the road is too bumpy.

[AlainNotHere]

I'm using the OEM VR sensor, trying to use any random sensor is the problem, regarding the teeth cut, missing teeth is the way to go it seems, I have like a month of literacy in the topic plus 2 masters I got from the corn flakes box.

My understanding of working is that you need to have something "different", so if you have all the teeth, the 12 of them, the same... how do you know when you skip one?

the missing teeth provides that "different" part, so the ECU can "count" and expect the "difference" to be there to be sure for every turn it's in "sync"

https://wiki.speeduino.com/en/decoders/Missing_Tooth

there is an entry in

https://wiki.speeduino.com/en/decoders

for the J30 pickup sensor but it's "in development"

https://wiki.speeduino.com/en/decoders/HondaJ30J32v2

some aftermarket pick up wheels

https://www.diyautotune.com/shop/sensor ... er-wheels/

I'm guessing if you want to later move your setup and use mega/micro squirt probably they have a setup for the missing tooth too.

and a lot of technical info from mega squirt about custom pickup wheels and sensors http://www.megamanual.com/ms2/36-1.htm

[PSIG]

My understanding of working is that you need to have something "different", so if you have all the teeth, the 12 of them, the same... how do you know when you skip one?

The cycle signal ("cam" signal). True it must have a reference to know where it is, and in this case the 6-2 cam signal would do that every cycle, establishing reference for crank position and cycle. Without a cycle signal, indeed the crank would need its own reference differential point (e.g., missing-tooth or other) to know relative crank position.

there is an entry in
https://wiki.speeduino.com/en/decoders
for the J30 pickup sensor but it's "in development"
https://wiki.speeduino.com/en/decoders/HondaJ30J32v2

True, but it should work, and is just waiting for someone with a J30 to confirm it. That could be you, and if all works well, it is no longer in-development. We have a few wizards that are really good with decoders that can quickly alter if necessary to make it right; but again we need that real-world somebody hands-on to verify it. <shrug>

[AlainNotHere]

Okay, we now need to talk about violence and background music... but not the once inflicted by the flesh, but the one carried on by the magnetic forces (90s x-man music playing in the background) and leverage...

Once you finish cabling, caring, testing, analyzing, thinking, imagining, power, obsession... Calvin Klein (steal from family guy) and you are ready to go (republica song playing in the background), if you happen to have your engine in a test bed well, you just pull... press... ummm how the heck do you start the thing?

I evaluated a couple of options... buying (ohhhhh I just discovered I can upload attachments here....) the assist engine on the honda accord and use it as starter motor, or use the honda flywheel and starter.

I decided to use the honda flywheel and starter but then it happens that the starter ring on the j30 series on the automatic versions goes on the transmission side... and automatic versions are the most common versions of the transmission for this engine (yes, I just did a search and found a j30 flywheel with starter ring on ebay and found one, on my defense I didn't on those early days of happiness and naivety... I know....).

So using all the scientific tools, the power of ai, and infinite wisdom and intelligence... I proceed to search for the j30 flexplate, copy the image and then sort by price on ebay flywheel, grab the first similar one... paste to word, scale to almost the same size, put a ruler on the screen... 6 screw holes... check, hole in the center check..... buy now

And that's how the OEM, absolutely Honda Camry flywheel came to my house... but due to the hot weather the thing expanded a bit... now I need to adapt it... I 3d print a couple of parts, try to put it in the back of the engine and once everything lined up, proceed to my metal 3d printer and print the parts... and they fit perfectly..... (that just happens on Milliard videos... that guy is amazing).....

I never first enlarged holes using a dremel just to discover that the thing was off center... never... nor the 3d print part were created to try to fix that... never... and I did never use that 3d print part in the actual engine, never... safety first....

Then I proceed to send that to send cut send... and 1 week later I had some metal pieces, I never stop being amazed at how is possible you can design something on a computer and then have a physical real thing delivered to your door...

Here is the starter and how it looks on the engine stand, you can see the adapting ring there, the circular plate is in the back of the engine to give me some clearance...





And here is the adapter as sent from send cut send... I totally discover that on my own... never by being entertained and inspired by SuperFastMatt on youtube.... never!



Here are the files you need to send to send cut send in case anybody need them

https://github.com/alainnothere/speedui ... ltArea.dxf
https://github.com/alainnothere/speedui ... erRing.dxf

as wheel as the stl to 3d print, github as a nice 3d view of it

https://github.com/alainnothere/speedui ... dapter.stl

I need another hour to write a post on how to secure the starter to the engine, those things are violent, the thing can pull around 600amp*12v=7000W!!!!, cable gauge 4 still gets hot if used "happily" like when testing why the thing doesn't start...